We make it habit to pick up "CARL" . . . "collecting all recycleable
litter" when we go out on the trail. This way I give back to my
planet. Good idea, there!





--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Boots Tex and Lone Star
Quilter" wrote:
>
> This is my first post on this group, although I have been an active
> member of the Texas list for a couple of years. A recent post of
> mine on that list has generated some interest in an idea that I am
> considering, so I have been asked to post it to this list. It
seems
> to be a general consensus that Texas state parks take a dim veiw of
> letterboxing, tending to group it with other "teasure hunting
> games". It occurs to me that we (letterboxers) need to do
something
> to actively promote our hobby by improving our image and separating
> ourselves from the other ones (not that there's anything wrong with
> the other ones). I have decided to place a box in a local state
park
> that has sometimes been anti-letterboxing and has been known to (or
> suspected of) confiscating letterboxes. My posted clues will say
> something like: "I would love for you to find my box and I will
> gladly send you the clues if you will promise to take along a
plastic
> bag and pick up trash as you travel to and from the box, then
contact
> me and let me know how much trash you collected". I will also
begin
> adding a note to my other letterboxes requesting that the finder
> please keep our parks beautiful by gathering trash as they go.
This
> is an experiment. When I get a history on the box I will contact
the
> park office and show them that this one box was responsible for
> ridding the park of 10 aluminum cans, 8 potato chip packages, 4
candy
> wrappers, or whatever the total might be. That's a good trade-off,
I
> think. Then I'll ask if it's okay to leave the box there. We'll
see
> what they say. Does anyone else want to join me in the
experiment?
> As one Texas letter boxer said, collecting trash makes a perfect
> diversion and is good for the environment at the same time.
>
> Boots Tex
>

If we really want to get organized about it and make a direct
impression on the park officials, how about a "Letterbox In Trash
Out", LITO, event like the geocachers do? Then we could gather bags
of trash into a big pile and take a photo for them to remember us by.
The Bird Stamper


--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Boots Tex and Lone Star
Quilter" wrote:
>
> This is my first post on this group, although I have been an active
> member of the Texas list for a couple of years. A recent post of
> mine on that list has generated some interest in an idea that I am
> considering, so I have been asked to post it to this list. It
seems
> to be a general consensus that Texas state parks take a dim veiw of
> letterboxing, tending to group it with other "teasure hunting
> games". It occurs to me that we (letterboxers) need to do
something
> to actively promote our hobby by improving our image and separating
> ourselves from the other ones (not that there's anything wrong with
> the other ones). I have decided to place a box in a local state
park
> that has sometimes been anti-letterboxing and has been known to (or
> suspected of) confiscating letterboxes. My posted clues will say
> something like: "I would love for you to find my box and I will
> gladly send you the clues if you will promise to take along a
plastic
> bag and pick up trash as you travel to and from the box, then
contact
> me and let me know how much trash you collected". I will also
begin
> adding a note to my other letterboxes requesting that the finder
> please keep our parks beautiful by gathering trash as they go.
This
> is an experiment. When I get a history on the box I will contact
the
> park office and show them that this one box was responsible for
> ridding the park of 10 aluminum cans, 8 potato chip packages, 4
candy
> wrappers, or whatever the total might be. That's a good trade-off,
I
> think. Then I'll ask if it's okay to leave the box there. We'll
see
> what they say. Does anyone else want to join me in the
experiment?
> As one Texas letter boxer said, collecting trash makes a perfect
> diversion and is good for the environment at the same time.
>
> Boots Tex
>

I think a Trash Out event is an awesome idea to make a big splash. It
demonstrates to park rangers that letterboxers are willing to get together
in their parks for the purpose of pitching in and toting out.

However, the thing I like about BootsTex' idea is that it demonstrates to
rangers that by having one box on their grounds, they reap "xxx" amount of
benefit. It gives them a quantitative way to measure the cost vs. the
benefit of a single box. It also shows that while they may not
see individual letterboxers come and go (and hopefully they DON'T see us
come and go), we are doing something positive EVERY time we go into a park.

--
Barefoot Lucy
"It's not about footwear, it's about philosophy"


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com [mailto:letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of Boots Tex and Lone Star Quilter
Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 1:53 PM
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [LbNA] Improving our image by gathering trash



This is my first post on this group, although I have been an active
member of the Texas list for a couple of years. A recent post of
mine on that list has generated some interest in an idea that I am
considering, so I have been asked to post it to this list. It seems
to be a general consensus that Texas state parks take a dim veiw of
letterboxing, tending to group it with other "teasure hunting
games". It occurs to me that we (letterboxers) need to do something
to actively promote our hobby by improving our image and separating
ourselves from the other ones (not that there's anything wrong with
the other ones). I have decided to place a box in a local state park
that has sometimes been anti-letterboxing and has been known to (or
suspected of) confiscating letterboxes. My posted clues will say
something like: "I would love for you to find my box and I will
gladly send you the clues if you will promise to take along a plastic
bag and pick up trash as you travel to and from the box, then contact
me and let me know how much trash you collected". I will also begin
adding a note to my other letterboxes requesting that the finder
please keep our parks beautiful by gathering trash as they go. This
is an experiment. When I get a history on the box I will contact the
park office and show them that this one box was responsible for
ridding the park of 10 aluminum cans, 8 potato chip packages, 4 candy
wrappers, or whatever the total might be. That's a good trade-off, I
think. Then I'll ask if it's okay to leave the box there. We'll see
what they say. Does anyone else want to join me in the experiment?
As one Texas letter boxer said, collecting trash makes a perfect
diversion and is good for the environment at the same time.

Boots Tex





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

But are park rangers really going to believe that the majority of
letterboxers will be doing that at the same time as they're out looking for
boxes or planting boxes?

Or are they more likely to weigh the consequences of disturbed environments,
possibly disturbed RARE environments or rare species, plus the possibility
of even more trash from the boxers who not only aren't going to take out
other folks' trash but might leave their own including abandoned boxes and
vandalised boxes?

Something tells me park rangers are too smart to believe that "EVERY time" a
letterboxer goes into a park, they're going to also be hauling out trash. I
know it's a nice warm-fuzzy-feeling kind of thought, but I think they're too
smart to think that's ever gonna start happening on anything other than a
one in a thousand basis......if even that. Like most of us, rangers may
have been born in the dark but it wasn't yesterday. If I was a ranger, I'd
be sayin' "Yeah, right......suuuure y'all are pickin' up garbage." I have
a hunch they're not going to feel there's any sort of REALISTIC cost/benefit
ratio there that would be in favor of letterboxing.

I'm definitely not saying it's not worth a shot. I'm just saying folks
shouldn't go gettin' their hopes up that it's going to change any sort of
negative preserve policies. :-)

~~ Mosey ~~

-----Original Message-----
From: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Barefoot Lucy
Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 8:17 AM
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [LbNA] Re: Improving our image by gathering trash


I think a Trash Out event is an awesome idea to make a big splash. It
demonstrates to park rangers that letterboxers are willing to get together
in their parks for the purpose of pitching in and toting out.

However, the thing I like about BootsTex' idea is that it demonstrates to
rangers that by having one box on their grounds, they reap "xxx" amount of
benefit. It gives them a quantitative way to measure the cost vs. the
benefit of a single box. It also shows that while they may not
see individual letterboxers come and go (and hopefully they DON'T see us
come and go), we are doing something positive EVERY time we go into a park.

--
Barefoot Lucy
"It's not about footwear, it's about philosophy"

Cool, idea, I love it! It's lends an almost mysterious air to the box
and also gives you an objective count of the amount of trash taken out.
Go for it. Jay in CT

>I have decided to place a box in a local state park
> that has sometimes been anti-letterboxing and has been known to (or
> suspected of) confiscating letterboxes. My posted clues will say
> something like: "I would love for you to find my box and I will
> gladly send you the clues if you will promise to take along a plastic
> bag and pick up trash as you travel to and from the box, then contact
> me and let me know how much trash you collected".

Perhaps I should have stated myself differently so as not to create the
possibility of getting caught up in verbiage - by saying "every" time, I
only meant that we do something as a matter of course vs. at a one time
event. My apologies on the wording...

And you're right the park ranger may not believe we always, every time pick
up trash and frankly, neither do I. I know I don't. Most of the time, I'm
pretty good about it, but sometimes I get so wrapped up talking to the folks
I'm with that I forget to watch out for trash, or I am so intent on the
clues that I forget about trash until after I've found the box. I confess
that I usually find more trash on my way out than I did on my way in, and
that lies in the fact that I have less to draw away my attention on my way
out. It would be silly to believe that every person does it exactly right
every time - by virtue of human nature, that's a failed effort before it
ever begins - but if we highlight the idea of trash pickup, it puts it
higher in the mind's eye than if we don't and it makes us all more likely to
do better.

Rangers do recognize effort when they see it though. If they approve a
given box and the placer points out that they are requiring trash pickup as
a condition of access to the clues, and then the placer contacts the park
about how much trash has been picked up by people visiting that box (or
heck, the boxer shows them their collection efforts as they leave the park),
and then the rangers go out into their own park and over time notice that it
does seem to be staying a little better, instead of attributing it to the
general public being cleaner, they might actually recognize that
letterboxers are beneficial to have around. Of course, that IS only
effective if we aren't causing a lot of harm and destruction because the
idea is to raise the benefit of letterboxing above the cost.

We actually have a pretty amazing story out in West Texas about how one
letterboxer/geocacher, Desert Warrior, through his efforts at working with
the parks and gaining their trust through his volunteer efforts and
demonstration of diligence and care, was given permission to place a box
where the ranger originally basically said "no way".

I think it is far better to do something, and even better - some things
- than to do nothing. If we lay back and do nothing, we leave it in the
hands of the folks less knowledgeable about letterboxing to make policies
for letterboxers. I believe that if we demonstrate ourselves to be willing
partners in park management, we'll make inroads far more quickly. Maybe not
with every ranger every time (again, the human nature thing), but if we can
reach one, then maybe we can reach two, and then maybe four...and eventually
we may even have a small voice in how stashing policies are written.

My .02,
Lucy




On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 9:42 AM, xxxxxxxx wrote:

> But are park rangers really going to believe that the majority of
> letterboxers will be doing that at the same time as they're out looking for
> boxes or planting boxes?
>
> Or are they more likely to weigh the consequences of disturbed
> environments,
> possibly disturbed RARE environments or rare species, plus the possibility
> of even more trash from the boxers who not only aren't going to take out
> other folks' trash but might leave their own including abandoned boxes and
> vandalised boxes?
>
> Something tells me park rangers are too smart to believe that "EVERY time"
> a
> letterboxer goes into a park, they're going to also be hauling out trash. I
> know it's a nice warm-fuzzy-feeling kind of thought, but I think they're
> too
> smart to think that's ever gonna start happening on anything other than a
> one in a thousand basis......if even that. Like most of us, rangers may
> have been born in the dark but it wasn't yesterday. If I was a ranger, I'd
> be sayin' "Yeah, right......suuuure y'all are pickin' up garbage." I have
> a hunch they're not going to feel there's any sort of REALISTIC
> cost/benefit
> ratio there that would be in favor of letterboxing.
>
> I'm definitely not saying it's not worth a shot. I'm just saying folks
> shouldn't go gettin' their hopes up that it's going to change any sort of
> negative preserve policies. :-)
>
> ~~ Mosey ~~
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com ]On
> Behalf Of Barefoot Lucy
> Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 8:17 AM
> To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [LbNA] Re: Improving our image by gathering trash
>
> I think a Trash Out event is an awesome idea to make a big splash. It
> demonstrates to park rangers that letterboxers are willing to get together
> in their parks for the purpose of pitching in and toting out.
>
> However, the thing I like about BootsTex' idea is that it demonstrates to
> rangers that by having one box on their grounds, they reap "xxx" amount of
> benefit. It gives them a quantitative way to measure the cost vs. the
> benefit of a single box. It also shows that while they may not
> see individual letterboxers come and go (and hopefully they DON'T see us
> come and go), we are doing something positive EVERY time we go into a park.
>
> --
> Barefoot Lucy
> "It's not about footwear, it's about philosophy"
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Well said Lucy. That's exactly what I was thinking, but I just
didn't know how to say it. Thanks. A small step, but who knows
where it could lead?

Boots Tex

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Barefoot Lucy"
wrote:
>
> Perhaps I should have stated myself differently so as not to create
the
> possibility of getting caught up in verbiage - by saying "every"
time, I
> only meant that we do something as a matter of course vs. at a one
time
> event. My apologies on the wording...
>
> And you're right the park ranger may not believe we always, every
time pick
> up trash and frankly, neither do I. I know I don't. Most of the
time, I'm
> pretty good about it, but sometimes I get so wrapped up talking to
the folks
> I'm with that I forget to watch out for trash, or I am so intent on
the
> clues that I forget about trash until after I've found the box. I
confess
> that I usually find more trash on my way out than I did on my way
in, and
> that lies in the fact that I have less to draw away my attention on
my way
> out. It would be silly to believe that every person does it
exactly right
> every time - by virtue of human nature, that's a failed effort
before it
> ever begins - but if we highlight the idea of trash pickup, it puts
it
> higher in the mind's eye than if we don't and it makes us all more
likely to
> do better.
>
> Rangers do recognize effort when they see it though. If they
approve a
> given box and the placer points out that they are requiring trash
pickup as
> a condition of access to the clues, and then the placer contacts
the park
> about how much trash has been picked up by people visiting that box
(or
> heck, the boxer shows them their collection efforts as they leave
the park),
> and then the rangers go out into their own park and over time
notice that it
> does seem to be staying a little better, instead of attributing it
to the
> general public being cleaner, they might actually recognize that
> letterboxers are beneficial to have around. Of course, that IS only
> effective if we aren't causing a lot of harm and destruction
because the
> idea is to raise the benefit of letterboxing above the cost.
>
> We actually have a pretty amazing story out in West Texas about how
one
> letterboxer/geocacher, Desert Warrior, through his efforts at
working with
> the parks and gaining their trust through his volunteer efforts and
> demonstration of diligence and care, was given permission to place
a box
> where the ranger originally basically said "no way".
>
> I think it is far better to do something, and even better - some
things
> - than to do nothing. If we lay back and do nothing, we leave it
in the
> hands of the folks less knowledgeable about letterboxing to make
policies
> for letterboxers. I believe that if we demonstrate ourselves to be
willing
> partners in park management, we'll make inroads far more quickly.
Maybe not
> with every ranger every time (again, the human nature thing), but
if we can
> reach one, then maybe we can reach two, and then maybe four...and
eventually
> we may even have a small voice in how stashing policies are written.
>
> My .02,
> Lucy
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 9:42 AM, xxxxxxxx wrote:
>
> > But are park rangers really going to believe that the majority
of
> > letterboxers will be doing that at the same time as they're out
looking for
> > boxes or planting boxes?
> >
> > Or are they more likely to weigh the consequences of disturbed
> > environments,
> > possibly disturbed RARE environments or rare species, plus the
possibility
> > of even more trash from the boxers who not only aren't going to
take out
> > other folks' trash but might leave their own including abandoned
boxes and
> > vandalised boxes?
> >
> > Something tells me park rangers are too smart to believe
that "EVERY time"
> > a
> > letterboxer goes into a park, they're going to also be hauling
out trash. I
> > know it's a nice warm-fuzzy-feeling kind of thought, but I think
they're
> > too
> > smart to think that's ever gonna start happening on anything
other than a
> > one in a thousand basis......if even that. Like most of us,
rangers may
> > have been born in the dark but it wasn't yesterday. If I was a
ranger, I'd
> > be sayin' "Yeah, right......suuuure y'all are pickin' up
garbage." I have
> > a hunch they're not going to feel there's any sort of REALISTIC
> > cost/benefit
> > ratio there that would be in favor of letterboxing.
> >
> > I'm definitely not saying it's not worth a shot. I'm just saying
folks
> > shouldn't go gettin' their hopes up that it's going to change any
sort of
> > negative preserve policies. :-)
> >
> > ~~ Mosey ~~
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com 40yahoogroups.com>
> > [mailto:letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com 40yahoogroups.com>]On
> > Behalf Of Barefoot Lucy
> > Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 8:17 AM
> > To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com 40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: Re: [LbNA] Re: Improving our image by gathering trash
> >
> > I think a Trash Out event is an awesome idea to make a big
splash. It
> > demonstrates to park rangers that letterboxers are willing to get
together
> > in their parks for the purpose of pitching in and toting out.
> >
> > However, the thing I like about BootsTex' idea is that it
demonstrates to
> > rangers that by having one box on their grounds, they reap "xxx"
amount of
> > benefit. It gives them a quantitative way to measure the cost vs.
the
> > benefit of a single box. It also shows that while they may not
> > see individual letterboxers come and go (and hopefully they DON'T
see us
> > come and go), we are doing something positive EVERY time we go
into a park.
> >
> > --
> > Barefoot Lucy
> > "It's not about footwear, it's about philosophy"
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

I went to Huntsville State Park this morning and planted a new box
called "Texas Trash". You'll have to contact me for the clues.
Perhaps I should have picked a "trashier" park. I took a trash bag
with me and walked probably 3 miles on the trails and found NO TRASH!
There was even a small picnic area near the trailhead and it was
perfectly clean. How can I pick up trash if there's no trash, and I
was looking for it to prove my point. I took the opportunity to
replace Lone Star Quilter's box The Bird in Black while I was there.
The image is the same and it is very close to the original location,
so isn't to be considered a new box. This is really a nice park and
would make a great place for an event if it didn't have the
reputation of being "anti-letterboxing".

Boots Tex

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Boots Tex and Lone Star
Quilter" wrote:
>
> Well said Lucy. That's exactly what I was thinking, but I just
> didn't know how to say it. Thanks. A small step, but who knows
> where it could lead?
>
> Boots Tex
>
> --- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Barefoot Lucy"
> wrote:
> >
> > Perhaps I should have stated myself differently so as not to
create
> the
> > possibility of getting caught up in verbiage - by saying "every"
> time, I
> > only meant that we do something as a matter of course vs. at a
one
> time
> > event. My apologies on the wording...
> >
> > And you're right the park ranger may not believe we always, every
> time pick
> > up trash and frankly, neither do I. I know I don't. Most of the
> time, I'm
> > pretty good about it, but sometimes I get so wrapped up talking
to
> the folks
> > I'm with that I forget to watch out for trash, or I am so intent
on
> the
> > clues that I forget about trash until after I've found the box.
I
> confess
> > that I usually find more trash on my way out than I did on my way
> in, and
> > that lies in the fact that I have less to draw away my attention
on
> my way
> > out. It would be silly to believe that every person does it
> exactly right
> > every time - by virtue of human nature, that's a failed effort
> before it
> > ever begins - but if we highlight the idea of trash pickup, it
puts
> it
> > higher in the mind's eye than if we don't and it makes us all
more
> likely to
> > do better.
> >
> > Rangers do recognize effort when they see it though. If they
> approve a
> > given box and the placer points out that they are requiring trash
> pickup as
> > a condition of access to the clues, and then the placer contacts
> the park
> > about how much trash has been picked up by people visiting that
box
> (or
> > heck, the boxer shows them their collection efforts as they leave
> the park),
> > and then the rangers go out into their own park and over time
> notice that it
> > does seem to be staying a little better, instead of attributing
it
> to the
> > general public being cleaner, they might actually recognize that
> > letterboxers are beneficial to have around. Of course, that IS
only
> > effective if we aren't causing a lot of harm and destruction
> because the
> > idea is to raise the benefit of letterboxing above the cost.
> >
> > We actually have a pretty amazing story out in West Texas about
how
> one
> > letterboxer/geocacher, Desert Warrior, through his efforts at
> working with
> > the parks and gaining their trust through his volunteer efforts
and
> > demonstration of diligence and care, was given permission to
place
> a box
> > where the ranger originally basically said "no way".
> >
> > I think it is far better to do something, and even better - some
> things
> > - than to do nothing. If we lay back and do nothing, we leave it
> in the
> > hands of the folks less knowledgeable about letterboxing to make
> policies
> > for letterboxers. I believe that if we demonstrate ourselves to
be
> willing
> > partners in park management, we'll make inroads far more
quickly.
> Maybe not
> > with every ranger every time (again, the human nature thing), but
> if we can
> > reach one, then maybe we can reach two, and then maybe four...and
> eventually
> > we may even have a small voice in how stashing policies are
written.
> >
> > My .02,
> > Lucy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 9:42 AM, xxxxxxxx wrote:
> >
> > > But are park rangers really going to believe that the
majority
> of
> > > letterboxers will be doing that at the same time as they're out
> looking for
> > > boxes or planting boxes?
> > >
> > > Or are they more likely to weigh the consequences of disturbed
> > > environments,
> > > possibly disturbed RARE environments or rare species, plus the
> possibility
> > > of even more trash from the boxers who not only aren't going to
> take out
> > > other folks' trash but might leave their own including
abandoned
> boxes and
> > > vandalised boxes?
> > >
> > > Something tells me park rangers are too smart to believe
> that "EVERY time"
> > > a
> > > letterboxer goes into a park, they're going to also be hauling
> out trash. I
> > > know it's a nice warm-fuzzy-feeling kind of thought, but I
think
> they're
> > > too
> > > smart to think that's ever gonna start happening on anything
> other than a
> > > one in a thousand basis......if even that. Like most of us,
> rangers may
> > > have been born in the dark but it wasn't yesterday. If I was a
> ranger, I'd
> > > be sayin' "Yeah, right......suuuure y'all are pickin' up
> garbage." I have
> > > a hunch they're not going to feel there's any sort of REALISTIC
> > > cost/benefit
> > > ratio there that would be in favor of letterboxing.
> > >
> > > I'm definitely not saying it's not worth a shot. I'm just
saying
> folks
> > > shouldn't go gettin' their hopes up that it's going to change
any
> sort of
> > > negative preserve policies. :-)
> > >
> > > ~~ Mosey ~~
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com > 40yahoogroups.com>
> > > [mailto:letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com > 40yahoogroups.com>]On
> > > Behalf Of Barefoot Lucy
> > > Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 8:17 AM
> > > To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com > 40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Subject: Re: [LbNA] Re: Improving our image by gathering trash
> > >
> > > I think a Trash Out event is an awesome idea to make a big
> splash. It
> > > demonstrates to park rangers that letterboxers are willing to
get
> together
> > > in their parks for the purpose of pitching in and toting out.
> > >
> > > However, the thing I like about BootsTex' idea is that it
> demonstrates to
> > > rangers that by having one box on their grounds, they
reap "xxx"
> amount of
> > > benefit. It gives them a quantitative way to measure the cost
vs.
> the
> > > benefit of a single box. It also shows that while they may not
> > > see individual letterboxers come and go (and hopefully they
DON'T
> see us
> > > come and go), we are doing something positive EVERY time we go
> into a park.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Barefoot Lucy
> > > "It's not about footwear, it's about philosophy"
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>